Cobrala
10-05-2003, 03:02 PM
I didn't want my questions to go unanswered because of being in the wrong thread, so I will start a new thread with them in it, as I feel they are important valid questions, concerns, and thoughts. Here are the copy/paste, from the previous thread, of my posts:
Originally posted by KenB
SCT Racer Package - $449
Allows shifting of timing and fuel curves
Adjust Speed limiters
Adjust Rev Limiters
Adjust axle ratio to correct speedometer after gear change
Adjust for tire diameter changes
Increse increase line pressure for greatly improved shifting (autos)
An example would be the fuel table. With the Racer version you will be able to shift the whole curve but not be able to tweak individual values like in the Pro Racer version.
The standard $449 Racer version sounds basically similar to a $419 DiabloSport Predator, but with your software/hardware you will need to have a pc to make changes to the above mentioned end user adjustments, correct?. I'm not trying to be indifferent here at all, but I do not see where the Racer version is really anymore beneficial than the Predator, or even the current Microtuner, for that matter, and again, especially versus the Predator, since your new setup will not initially offer any datalogging, nor even any simple diagnostics abilities. What happens when that is finally offered, the current customers have to spend more $ just to get your version of the Microtuner updated, or will they be out of luck just how all the current Superchips Microtuner owners are, i.e. no current upgrade trade-in value (I would hope that you're aware that DiabloSport offers free upgrades to their customers!)? Read here:
Information taken from another thread in this forum:
A forum member asks:
Originally posted by Andrew WOT
2) That flasher, which I understand is a modified version of Microtuner, will it be able to read diagnostic codes and doing simple adjustment to the tune like changing rev limiter or shifting points without laptop like original microtuner does.
You respond with:
Originally posted by SCT Guy
I answered this in another thread, but the answers are...
Number 2, no it won't. We are working on a seperate tool to do this and datalog. It's coming.
It sounds like there is just a bit more money to invest even after the initial $449 price of the standard Racer version. That already sounds as if it is getting kindof steep :( Comparing your Pro Racer version to say LS1Edit for the GM owners, LS1Edit has a $550 price to be able to do full adjustment to the pcm like your Pro Racer version of $795, plus the LS1Edit interface cable will allow up to 3 more additional VIN # inputs for $150 each, in case the customer gets another vehicle, or decides to share the software/hardware with a friend. And with that being said, you state your system will VIN lock ("marry") to the vehicle, but is this just for the Pro Racer version, or both that and the cheaper Racer version? The Ford Predator allows the owner to use it on another applicable vehicle, so long as they restore the programming back to the original backup on the currently tuned vehicle with it.
Please expound as able, as I'm trying to justify spending $30 more for something that offers 1/2 the overall features, to be fair, of what a product like the Predator offers right away (and, again, even the current Superchips Microtuner), plus it not offering the convenience of not having to tote around a laptop or run inside to your desktop pc to make necessary changes to the limited end user adjustments.
Thank you for your important time.
Post #2:
Originally posted by jmlay
Cobrala,
It was my understanding that the Predator would marry to the vin and that was it!!! No way to change it. I asked a dealer that exact question and was told now it will not and never will allow you to program another, even if the origional program is returned to the first.
Mike,
That's not true on the DiabloSport Ford Predators, as it is on the GM Predators. I know this for a fact, as not only does it say it right in the manual, but if you have a Ford Predator and try it, you will see exactly that it does unmarry from the VIN (I know, I have one, tried it, and successfully used it on 2 other friends' Cobras). The Predator also works for all 3 of the calibration codes on the Cobra (QUD2, YHD0, YHD1), and will work with any newer ones that may be released by Ford, once a revision update is released for it from DiabloSport (which are free, too), plus I was told that the same part # will support the '04 Cobras as well, once they are out and added in by DiabloSport. All of this keeps the resale value of the tool up pretty good, too.
Concerning my previous questions, hopefully they will be answered, soon, as I brought up some very valid points, questions, and concerns.
Post #3:
Originally posted by Don 95Vert
Looking at the surface the Diablo thing might seem like a good buy, but it doesn't compare at all. If you are basing your decision on price, just get a Hypertech chip...
Can you show me where the difference of making it "better" really is versus the standard Racer version and the Predator? They've already said that it will allow only limited adjustment, whereas the fuel and timing curves are only allowed to be shifted together and not by individual cells (read my post above).
Furthermore, since it requires, right away, that the user tote around a laptop with them at the track to make simple adjustments, or be near a pc of some sorts (since they've already admitted the tool that will datalog and offer adjustment through the tool, like the Predator, is still being "developed"), then I don't see how paying $449 will be anymore beneficial than the Predator, and what it (the Predator) already offers (datalogging, monitoring, adjustment of tune through the tool, custom tunes through internet, or in person, through DiabloSport, or through a soon to be established base of Revolution dealers across the country).
The Pro Racer version, yes, I will agree that is offers complete tuning ability, but this is for those who are affluent in this, or for those who want to learn it (as you said in comparing to your "college course"), for what could be considered, to some, a steep $795.
I'm still within my 30 day return policy on the Predator, and although I like it a lot, love it, actually (already has proven itself on the dyno and at the track), I could be swayed on upgrading to a better system, for the same or slightly more price (when I say "slightly" I mean the $30 difference between the standard Racer version and the Predator), but I just don't see it, at all. :dontknow:
Originally posted by KenB
SCT Racer Package - $449
Allows shifting of timing and fuel curves
Adjust Speed limiters
Adjust Rev Limiters
Adjust axle ratio to correct speedometer after gear change
Adjust for tire diameter changes
Increse increase line pressure for greatly improved shifting (autos)
An example would be the fuel table. With the Racer version you will be able to shift the whole curve but not be able to tweak individual values like in the Pro Racer version.
The standard $449 Racer version sounds basically similar to a $419 DiabloSport Predator, but with your software/hardware you will need to have a pc to make changes to the above mentioned end user adjustments, correct?. I'm not trying to be indifferent here at all, but I do not see where the Racer version is really anymore beneficial than the Predator, or even the current Microtuner, for that matter, and again, especially versus the Predator, since your new setup will not initially offer any datalogging, nor even any simple diagnostics abilities. What happens when that is finally offered, the current customers have to spend more $ just to get your version of the Microtuner updated, or will they be out of luck just how all the current Superchips Microtuner owners are, i.e. no current upgrade trade-in value (I would hope that you're aware that DiabloSport offers free upgrades to their customers!)? Read here:
Information taken from another thread in this forum:
A forum member asks:
Originally posted by Andrew WOT
2) That flasher, which I understand is a modified version of Microtuner, will it be able to read diagnostic codes and doing simple adjustment to the tune like changing rev limiter or shifting points without laptop like original microtuner does.
You respond with:
Originally posted by SCT Guy
I answered this in another thread, but the answers are...
Number 2, no it won't. We are working on a seperate tool to do this and datalog. It's coming.
It sounds like there is just a bit more money to invest even after the initial $449 price of the standard Racer version. That already sounds as if it is getting kindof steep :( Comparing your Pro Racer version to say LS1Edit for the GM owners, LS1Edit has a $550 price to be able to do full adjustment to the pcm like your Pro Racer version of $795, plus the LS1Edit interface cable will allow up to 3 more additional VIN # inputs for $150 each, in case the customer gets another vehicle, or decides to share the software/hardware with a friend. And with that being said, you state your system will VIN lock ("marry") to the vehicle, but is this just for the Pro Racer version, or both that and the cheaper Racer version? The Ford Predator allows the owner to use it on another applicable vehicle, so long as they restore the programming back to the original backup on the currently tuned vehicle with it.
Please expound as able, as I'm trying to justify spending $30 more for something that offers 1/2 the overall features, to be fair, of what a product like the Predator offers right away (and, again, even the current Superchips Microtuner), plus it not offering the convenience of not having to tote around a laptop or run inside to your desktop pc to make necessary changes to the limited end user adjustments.
Thank you for your important time.
Post #2:
Originally posted by jmlay
Cobrala,
It was my understanding that the Predator would marry to the vin and that was it!!! No way to change it. I asked a dealer that exact question and was told now it will not and never will allow you to program another, even if the origional program is returned to the first.
Mike,
That's not true on the DiabloSport Ford Predators, as it is on the GM Predators. I know this for a fact, as not only does it say it right in the manual, but if you have a Ford Predator and try it, you will see exactly that it does unmarry from the VIN (I know, I have one, tried it, and successfully used it on 2 other friends' Cobras). The Predator also works for all 3 of the calibration codes on the Cobra (QUD2, YHD0, YHD1), and will work with any newer ones that may be released by Ford, once a revision update is released for it from DiabloSport (which are free, too), plus I was told that the same part # will support the '04 Cobras as well, once they are out and added in by DiabloSport. All of this keeps the resale value of the tool up pretty good, too.
Concerning my previous questions, hopefully they will be answered, soon, as I brought up some very valid points, questions, and concerns.
Post #3:
Originally posted by Don 95Vert
Looking at the surface the Diablo thing might seem like a good buy, but it doesn't compare at all. If you are basing your decision on price, just get a Hypertech chip...
Can you show me where the difference of making it "better" really is versus the standard Racer version and the Predator? They've already said that it will allow only limited adjustment, whereas the fuel and timing curves are only allowed to be shifted together and not by individual cells (read my post above).
Furthermore, since it requires, right away, that the user tote around a laptop with them at the track to make simple adjustments, or be near a pc of some sorts (since they've already admitted the tool that will datalog and offer adjustment through the tool, like the Predator, is still being "developed"), then I don't see how paying $449 will be anymore beneficial than the Predator, and what it (the Predator) already offers (datalogging, monitoring, adjustment of tune through the tool, custom tunes through internet, or in person, through DiabloSport, or through a soon to be established base of Revolution dealers across the country).
The Pro Racer version, yes, I will agree that is offers complete tuning ability, but this is for those who are affluent in this, or for those who want to learn it (as you said in comparing to your "college course"), for what could be considered, to some, a steep $795.
I'm still within my 30 day return policy on the Predator, and although I like it a lot, love it, actually (already has proven itself on the dyno and at the track), I could be swayed on upgrading to a better system, for the same or slightly more price (when I say "slightly" I mean the $30 difference between the standard Racer version and the Predator), but I just don't see it, at all. :dontknow: